tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8695598.post803551610602786889..comments2023-12-17T19:35:07.459-08:00Comments on Bouphonia: Skillful ManagementPhilahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15849261651028725772noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8695598.post-81165687270420577312007-04-13T12:26:00.000-07:002007-04-13T12:26:00.000-07:00Hi David, Thanks for your comment! As I said in my...Hi David, <BR/><BR/>Thanks for your comment! As I said in my post, I agree that there's a need for ecosystem valuation, and I understand that it's a work in progress (or, hopefully, a transition towards a better approach).<BR/><BR/>Again, my quarrel was ultimately just with the statement that bees are a "fantastic" example of "skillful management." I don't see it.<BR/><BR/>That said, I agree with everything you've said here, as well as with other posts you've written on the subject at WC.Philahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15849261651028725772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8695598.post-43711820100612427972007-04-13T12:20:00.000-07:002007-04-13T12:20:00.000-07:00the committee report on colony collapse disorder c...the committee report on colony collapse disorder cited stress from frequent relocation (well done, olvlzl) and the use of neonicotinoid pesticides as probable causes for the sudden and nationwide drops in commercial bee populations, as well as hive splitting, overcrowding, and forced pollination of crops with minimal nutritional value. so, yeah, the use of the phrase "skillful management" here raises my eybrows a bit, in much the same way the phrase "heck of a job" did back in the late summer of 2005.<BR/><BR/>valuing an ecosystem should mean recognizing the inherent value of every aspect of it, as opposed to simply applying a dollar value to what human beings stand to reap from it. we'll blow it every time if we can't stop approaching the process in our traditionally egocentric manner, because it blinds us to a lot of small but essential things--such as, apparently, the notion that dusting crops that will be pollinated by commercial bee colonies with pesticides that are known to have profoundly damaging and disorienting effects on those bees might be a bad idea, or that working animals, even insects, need to be healthy in order to work.juniper pearlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09940950405860078123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8695598.post-45377784335504177312007-04-13T00:10:00.000-07:002007-04-13T00:10:00.000-07:00Very nice commentary, and thanks for reading World...Very nice commentary, and thanks for reading Worldchanging! While I don't have the energy to go point by point through your analysis, I just wanted to make some general clarifications. The concept of ecosystem services has emerged as a new way to view the world that we live in and the services that nature provides us that are sometimes taken for granted. In most cases economics does not have the tools to properly value these goods and services, as we are quickly finding out in the research community. Also, how does one compare the services of pollination with air quality, for example? There is no framework (yet) that exists that allows us to compare the benefits of a suite of services and how they might change through human management. What we do have is a set of tools (economics) which has been used for many years (I will let you decide whether the outcome has been positive or negative) that is now being applied to ecosystems. That said, what we really need is a way to value ecosystems differently. Whether the economic system shifts to incorporate the intricacies of ecology or a wholly new system emerges, only time will tell. Regardless, it is still important to grasp the magnitude of changes that are happening and try to understand them in the frameworks that are available today, acknowledging they might not be perfect. <BR/><BR/>Best Regards-<BR/>~David Zaks<BR/>Worldchanging.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8695598.post-85535808135300483152007-04-12T18:34:00.000-07:002007-04-12T18:34:00.000-07:00I'll bet that the widespread trucking of enormous ...I'll bet that the widespread trucking of enormous numbers of bees all over the country will turn out to have had a part in this. There was an attack of throat mites in the 80s, as I recall. <BR/><BR/>Commodification of nature is the heart of the problem. There are some things that can't be a commodity, nature, people, democracy, the truth. The absurd idea of economics, that everything is reducible to an economic analysis of is leading us to extinction. Increasingly, the problems of distorion inherent in any analysis is becoming important. The means chosen to look at something will end up having at least a large part in the conclusions drawn. In economics, as in other alleged sciences, the analysis seems to drive the outcomes. That's not unexpected, the methods are subjective, often chosen for reasons of ideology, professional and financial interest instead of rigor and objectivity. It took abolitionists a long time to overcome these biases in dealing with slavery. The obvious horror of that system eventuall broke through the pseudo-science and the smokescreen sent up by financial interest. In the near future the same horrors will give the world a slap in the face that won't be able to be ignored. The question is if it will come in time. <BR/><BR/>You're having a great week, Phila.olvlzlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15329638018157415801noreply@blogger.com